http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87?format=rss Tribe.net. Local Connections http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#f6276f9c-3cd4-4e6b-a812-f114e3b14ba7 Who defines a custom weapon? Ben Franklin does. Thu, 17 Jan 2008 22:46:12 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#f6276f9c-3cd4-4e6b-a812-f114e3b14ba7 Adam 2008-01-17T22:46:12Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#e39131ce-da1d-4538-b8c3-ed47ccc5185c Personally, I think a custom firearm is anything the purchaser uniquely specified or had personalized. Perhaps cosmetic mods, diff internals to an all-out frankenstein? Wed, 16 Jan 2008 10:33:47 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#e39131ce-da1d-4538-b8c3-ed47ccc5185c Novan 2008-01-16T10:33:47Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#eb855892-902e-4097-8f1e-c4230c900493 But I guess in my defense, I don't think every match-grade les baers trigger or barrel is hand-crafted from a chunk of aluminium and a chisel.... I do believe they have some sort of manufacturing process for the parts they use? 'small runs' may have been a misstatement. ...but you are right, I was completely half-cocked after a quick glance at a link to a ruger MKII with integral silencer. They are not supplied by Bill himself. Wed, 16 Jan 2008 04:38:11 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#eb855892-902e-4097-8f1e-c4230c900493 $item.owner.firstName 2008-01-16T04:38:11Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#cb5bdc63-f836-48a7-8b87-e42e44757ff1 no, but I can definitely tell you this: it pays to do more homework before posting! = ) Wed, 16 Jan 2008 04:32:42 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#cb5bdc63-f836-48a7-8b87-e42e44757ff1 $item.owner.firstName 2008-01-16T04:32:42Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#db35f1d5-0175-4c99-a2f1-48a311553a69 What "small runs of stamped-out parts.." does Les Baer make? Could you give me Ruger's product# for thier "alternative production run" intergral silenced MKII? Wed, 16 Jan 2008 03:22:45 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#db35f1d5-0175-4c99-a2f1-48a311553a69 $item.owner.firstName 2008-01-16T03:22:45Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#a34de027-8af6-4487-b420-1c4da8e9d0df well, as usuall I cannot resist the urge to be the antagonist here. Who defines what is custom(ized) and what is good enough to be called custom (built)? Surely, SOMEONE 'built' Chad's SKS into what it is today. was it a licenced gunsmith? no. was it a fancy factory? no. It was chad. Is there a licence or a certification for making 'custom-built' guns? I'd like to see what the placcard looks like. or are they each 'customized' to their owners? Even Les Baers makes small runs of stamped-out parts for their 'customizations'....now how is this different from the SKS polymer stock chad bought at the army surplus store? Where is the line that defines a small enough production run to be a 'custom-building-part'? Where is the line of expertise needed, or the price tag charged, for the work being done? If we were lawyers and this were a major decision, I think the ONLY clear-cut enough definition to all agree on in any situation and any case, is ANY modification from factory-stock.... Does not matter it it was finely engraved, or gouged with a hammer and a nail in Bubba's garage table steel vice. And along these clear-cut definitions, I'm sorry to say that a Ruger MKII with integral silencer is not a custom built gun, it is an alternative production run on a factory gun. Get a normal MKII and fit or have a silencer fitted to it and integrated, yes. it is now a custom weapon. Tue, 15 Jan 2008 07:48:50 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#a34de027-8af6-4487-b420-1c4da8e9d0df $item.owner.firstName 2008-01-15T07:48:50Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#3f7fa2a0-ada3-4d81-829c-ddda67e82150 As much as I hate car analogies, you hit the nail on the head. Customized, yes... custom-built, no. That's a distinction that hasn't been made in the thread before now, though. Mon, 14 Jan 2008 19:55:31 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#3f7fa2a0-ada3-4d81-829c-ddda67e82150 $item.owner.firstName 2008-01-14T19:55:31Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#e17ca3ac-bab4-4997-a38c-dcb9b43e68e8 I do see the argument tho. Is a Honda Civic with an AEM package and upgraded lighting customized? I think so. Is it a custom built car? Ehhhh... Mon, 14 Jan 2008 16:05:42 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#e17ca3ac-bab4-4997-a38c-dcb9b43e68e8 Mickey 2008-01-14T16:05:42Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#81e00cfd-e249-47d6-beb0-20e4f98faaee Guess that means your definition of custom is different, but I assure you... I can still call a mass-produced rifle fitted with a mass-produced stock a custom weapon. Mon, 14 Jan 2008 15:56:37 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#81e00cfd-e249-47d6-beb0-20e4f98faaee $item.owner.firstName 2008-01-14T15:56:37Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#8e4b51da-df88-4128-af0e-55c37b8f799c I don't know if you can call a mass produced rifle fitted with a mass produced stock a custom weapon. Custom implies quality, and a custom gun would be a quality offering special from the standard issue. My AK may be highly tricked out, even pimped, but there was no special fitting, no extra machining, nothing that you couldn't order from a catalog. Engraving would indeed be custom. A Ruger MKII with an integral silencer would be custom. A take down 1886 in 49-90 would be custom. An SKS with a Ramline stock and a Barska scope would not. Les Baer would a custom gun manufacturer. Mon, 14 Jan 2008 05:27:07 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#8e4b51da-df88-4128-af0e-55c37b8f799c Adam 2008-01-14T05:27:07Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#663349c4-3fb9-4359-956b-a55ab263a9fc What if you drill 4 hole's in a 4x4 block with metal pipe inserted for gun barrel's fitting 3 inch buckshot using nail's for firing pin's with spring's off of mole trap's and fishing string for a trigger? would that be a custom gun or a booby trap? haha Sat, 12 Jan 2008 23:45:40 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#663349c4-3fb9-4359-956b-a55ab263a9fc $item.owner.firstName 2008-01-12T23:45:40Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#40647756-a2b3-47fe-81d5-e01f86a58ae6 My definition of custom is anything that has been modified beyond what it was when it came out of the factory. My SKS has a synthetic stock and a scope, thus it is custom. Heavily customized? No. But customized none-the-less. Sat, 12 Jan 2008 23:06:33 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#40647756-a2b3-47fe-81d5-e01f86a58ae6 $item.owner.firstName 2008-01-12T23:06:33Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#ed02e554-127f-40df-92cb-0e4bf2285149 oh yea...you forgot about everyone's 'custom' SKS with a synthetic stock...or their 'custom' 700 with forward-mounted 'scout' scope. And how about engraved guns which are otherwise factory-stock? are they 'custom' or not? I think the only real, technical definition of the word, would have to qualify ANY modification to ANY gun, setting it apart from the stock configuration. and that includes the sawed-off and duct-taped 'pistol' stock my cousin did to his daisy air gun, and the wolf springs I put on my Ruger wheelgun. As much as it might piss off the high and haughty with their multi-multi thousand dollar custom built guns to be lumped into the same category as backyard butchers and minor tinkerers, this is the only definition that works all around. Any other definition, is subjective opinion. Sat, 12 Jan 2008 19:40:20 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#ed02e554-127f-40df-92cb-0e4bf2285149 $item.owner.firstName 2008-01-12T19:40:20Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#7cf86c52-a7c4-4732-8501-3688df1d8774 Who are the "custom manufacturers" out there? Sat, 12 Jan 2008 18:33:09 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#7cf86c52-a7c4-4732-8501-3688df1d8774 Mickey 2008-01-12T18:33:09Z http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#d7f925dc-4a48-4fc0-9d63-ebc47ea6b353 Just wondering what people think constitutes a custom firearm. Some "custom" shops build firearms from only thier own parts that are hand fitted, in an assembly line type setup where one person fits only certain parts. Some "custom" shops build firearms from whatever parts you want and where one gunsmith builds from start to finish. And I'm sure there are combinations of the two. OTHER THOUGHTS: CNC/manual machining vs. handmade. While there are some things that need to be machined, there's something to be said about the craftsmanship of something that was hand filed, polished, fitted. Shoot well, Allan Sat, 12 Jan 2008 16:01:29 GMT http://gunversation.tribe.net/thread/22e37f4b-d2ee-4bd3-9b7e-c291a0bf8d87#d7f925dc-4a48-4fc0-9d63-ebc47ea6b353 $item.owner.firstName 2008-01-12T16:01:29Z