Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns's topics - tribe.net

Glocks explode in user's hands

2010-01-05T22:03:43Z

Florida police have un-modified Glocks using factory loads explode twice.
http://www.theledger.com/article/20080313/NEWS/803130481?Title=Haven-Police-Ditch-Glocks-After-Two-Explode
They are ditching the guns.

Portland Or police have had the same problems
http://forums.realpolice.net/firearms-4/10770-portland-police-suspend-use-glock-45-cal.html

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 4 replies

On the Second Amendment

2010-01-05T03:23:41Z

"If you were one of America's Founders, and you'd just surprised the world... by winning a war of secession against the most powerful and heavy-handed government on the planet, and the last thing in the world you wanted for yourself, for your children, or for your grandchildren was to fall beneath the heels of its jackboots again, what would you want the Bill of Rights to mean? And if the first act, under martial law, of that powerful, heavy-handed government had been to try to take your guns away at Lexington and Concord, would you have written a Second Amendment to guarantee its 'right' to own and carry weapons? Would you have written a Second Amendment that was subject to whatever government claims is 'reasonable regulation'? Or would you have written the Second Amendment to forbid government from having anything to do with your guns?" ~ L. Neil Smith

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

Good trade!

2009-12-24T04:12:17Z

I purchased a Taurus PT145SS and hate it. It would jamb horribly if I did'nt clean it after only 150 rounds. I purchased an extra magazine, and regret it. I put the thing on consignment and it sold. Yea! So then, I transfered the money to the purchase on a Glock 23C. I had to pay about two bills more but I'm sure it's gonna be worth it. I reasearched the Taurus pretty well before I bought it. You-tube is full of accounts that give it praise and accolades. I thought 10 rounds of 45 Oooh! gotta have it. What a mistake. I should have known, I've bought plenty of junk guns before and know not to waste money on lesser brands.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 7 replies

Change I can Believe in

2009-12-14T18:30:17Z

I'd vote for this guy!
Lieutenant Colonel Allen West
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VP2p91dvm6M

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

Hunting and our Rights

2009-11-20T21:25:10Z

It's the time of year, at least here in Wisconsin. Opening weekend of deer season. So while I've been itching for this since last season, a friend wrote this in one of my email groups and it got me thinking. We have some pretty crazy rules when it comes to hunting here. I know that back where I grew up in Tennessee it was pretty simple. Buy your stamp, go hunting and don't kill more than the bag limit. Here in Wisconsin it's pretty well out of hand. But I'll copy and paste his musings below. the thoughts are something that many of us really don't think about.

I know I'm "out there" on this, but I'm going to throw a bunch of raw ridiculous thoughts out there anyway. I am not suggesting that there is a "conspiracy" per-se. (I'd like to think that I don't generally go for this type of thinking). However, I will admit to believing in a "fraternity of thought" that results in a "political paradigm." So, please forgive me my conspiratorial tone.....

The government and the greenie-fascists running the DNR know that they have to dismantle our hunting culture if they want to destroy the political solidarity of Gun owners (the last bastion of protection for our 2nd amendment -which has been a thorn in the side of the 545 oligarchical who-ars in DC for two centuries). If they are able to disrupt the cultural traditions of hunting (located especially in the mid-western and mountain states), then the Usurpers that govern these agencies know that the pro-hunter, pro-firearm lobby will weaken. Outlawing (through incremental legislative action) and confiscation of the hardware are right around the corner without real political resistance after that.

Consider the effect that the hand-wringing "pandemic germophobic" mentality surrounding the much publicized CWD, alone, has had on this culture. Additionally, by doing simple things like disrupting the zones, fees, SS# reqs, applications, seasons, complicating rules and bagging procedures; these ass-grabbing bureaucrats seem to be doing a great job at disrupting a cherished cultural tradition and rite of passage that has been part of my family (and many of yours) since we were children and long long before. This approach wreaks of the "more regulation and control is better" mentality that I know we all despise. When the "bread and circuses" of the NFL-WWE-Days of Our Lives-Dancing with the Stars-Facebook-Twitter-welfare textfest is added to this already boiling politically apathetic/ignorant stewpot; I see us headed for bad places. (Maybe we're already there....We've allowed them to regulate the hell out of hunting as long as they have allowed us to continue to do it.) Hunting/gathering food is something that, on some level, men should have the right to do naturally without the permissions of Government. (Though I'll stipulate to a necessity to set bag limits etc)

Every egg I eat (or share) without the approval of the Corpro-fascist USDA, every drop of wine I drink from my own untaxed vines, every day I drive a '95 Dodge Neon without a car loan payment to a government-suckled finance or auto company, every day that the sun shines and my house is heated by it's concentrated and collected radiance, every time I put on my shoes and go to work to sing the song of freedom's birth, AND every time I swing my rifle over my shoulder and walk into the woods -alone if I have to- is my moment of rebellion against the darkness!

No, gents. I will not go gentle into this good night! As a matter of patriotic principle, expect to see me in blaze orange saturday morning -in my back yard if nowhere else!

Good luck and safe hunting guys.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 1 reply

your rights are suspended

2009-11-13T08:21:23Z

My dad sent me this
Over two months ago, the National Association for Gun Rights first broke this incredible tale out of Shreveport, Louisiana.

At the time, no other gun rights organization had touched the story. But when we tracked down the victim for an interview, we couldn't believe what we heard, and we immediately sent out a nationwide alert.

The story went viral overnight.

If this tale of government abuse moves you, send it to a friend or family member to get the word out.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

According to Cedric Glover, mayor of Shreveport, Louisiana, his cops "have a power that [. . .] the President of these Unites States does not have": His cops can take away your rights.

And would you like to guess which rights he has in mind?

Just ask Shreveport resident Robert Baillio, who got pulled over for having two pro-gun bumper stickers on the back of his truck -- and had his gun confiscated.

While the officer who pulled him over says Baillio failed to use his turn signal, the only questions he had for Baillio concerned guns: Whether he had a gun, where the gun was, and if he was a member of a pro-gun organization. No requests for a driver's licence, proof of insurance, or vehicle registration -- and no discussion of a turn signal.
Accordingly, Baillio told the officer the truth, which led the police officer to search his car without permission and confiscate his gun.

However, not only does Louisiana law allow resident to drive with loaded weapons in their vehicles, but Mr. Baillio possessed a concealed carry license!

What does such behavior demonstrate, other than transparent political profiling -- going so far as to use the infamous Department of Homeland Security report on "Americans of a rightwing persuasion" as a how-to guidebook, no less?

Mr. Baillio made no secret of his political affiliations: An American flag centers a wide flourish of pro-freedom stickers and decals on his back windshield.

In fact, when Baillio asked the officer if everyone he pulls over gets the same treatment, the officer said no and pointed to the back of his truck.

Baillio phoned Mayor Glover to complain about this "suspension of rights" only to find that his city's morbidly obese "commander in chief" was elated at the story: According to Glover, Baillio got "served well, protected well, and even got a consideration that maybe [he] should not have gotten."

Thankfully, Mr. Baillio recorded a good bit of that phone call. You can watch a video with the transcriptions here. I've reproduced a chunk of the call below:

Baillio: (in the context of being asked about the presence of a gun) Well, I answered that question honestly, and he disarmed me.

Glover: Which would be an appropriate and proper action, sir. The fact that you gave the correct answer -- it simply means that you did what it is you were supposed to have done, and that is to give that weapon to the police officer so he could appropriately place it in a place where it would not be a threat to you, to him, or to anyone in the general public.

[. . .]

Glover: My direction to you is that, had you chosen not to properly identify the fact that you had a weapon and directed that officer to where that weapon was located; had you been taken from the vehicle, and the officer, in the interest of his safety, chose to secure you in a safe position, and then looked, found, and determined that you did, in fact, have a weapon...then, sir, you would have faced additional, [inaudible], and more severe criminal sanctions.

Baillio: So what you're saying is: I give up all my rights to keep and bear arms if I'm stopped by the police: Is that correct?

Glover: Sir, you have no right, when you have been pulled over by a police officer for a potential criminal offense [which would be what?! - DB] to stand there with your weapon at your side in your hand [Baillio's weapon was nowhere near his side or his hand, and Glover knew that. -- DB] because of your second amendment rights, sir. That does not mean at that point your second amendment right has been taken away; it means at that particular point in time, it has been suspended.

Will Grigg from ProLibertate, an excellent freedom blog, has this to say:

According to Glover, a police officer may properly disarm any civilian at any time, and the civilian's duty is to surrender his gun -- willingly, readily, cheerfully, without cavil or question.

From Glover's perspective, it is only when firearms are in the hands of people other than the state's uniformed enforcers/oppressors that they constitute a threat, not only to the public and those in charge of exercising official violence but also to the private gun owner himself.
NAGR spoke with Mr. Baillio, and he told us that he's in the process of securing the official procedures and codes for firearm handling and private property confiscation for the Shreveport police department.

So far, the city has been half-heartedly cooperating with him.

"I felt sick," Baillio told NAGR. "My uncles didn't die for this country so I could surrender my rights like a wimp. I felt terrible. I was just thinking of all that my family has done for freedom in this nation -- including dying -- and here they are disarming me at a traffic stop."

What to do?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 32 replies

American Sovereignty for Sale

2009-11-13T08:04:57Z

So, I heard this rumor that Obama is planning to sign over American Sovereignty to the UN. I had to look this up. Everything is vague as far as any reports on this, thus far but there does seem to be at least something in the works with the intention of sliding it under our noses. The only thing I was able to find at this point was an article from a Canadian Newspaper and this video with Chris Monckton who is a climate change expert that the Democrats refused to allow Al Gore to debate because they knew that Monckton would tear Gore apart with actual facts instead of a bunch of made up tripe! So can or has anyone been able to find anything solid to validate this? If that be the case then I fear that a bloody time is not far ahead of us. If we fall under U.N. regulations then our Constitution could become void. At least this is what I think will happen...

But anyway here is the video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5kJ5bt5-wI

And the article here with a link to the original. http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/15901
In jeopardy of imminent betrayal by their own Commander in Chief, America leans on the memory of Reagan for inspiration
Calling Mark Levin to the Rescue
The troops at Canada Free Press (CFP) are on duty tonight.
CFP troops Jim O’Neill, who proudly served in the U.S. Navy from 1970 to 1974 in both UDT-21 (Underwater Demolition Team) and SEAL Team Two and Jerry McConnell, former Marine Scout who served in WWII, was a veteran of Guadalcanal and is today a proud Peas greeter for departing and returning American troops, are warning liberty lovers worldwide that the anti-American President Barack Obama is about to hand over American sovereignty to the United Nations.
...”America is barreling towards becoming a bit player on the world’s stage, and its vaunted middle class—once the envy of the world—is on the verge of being eliminated. For the good of the planet, for the good of Gaia, for the good of the collective,” writes O’Neill.
...”Aided and abetted by imposters posing as authentic American citizens the United States of America has been taken over by an authentic dictator. How could so many millions of U.S. citizens just gently cede their heritage and birthrite so easily; without more than a whimper?” writes McConnell.
On a Saturday night these Paul Reveres of the WorldWide Net are raising the alarm that Obama is fixing to sign an outrageous “treaty” at December’s 2009 United Nations Climate Change Conference in Copenhagen. Signed, sealed and delivered this treaty will not only bring the nations of the world into a One World Government but will cancel the very sovereignty of the United States of America.
What kind of president other than an agent under someone’s control would, with the stroke of a pen, sign away all that America is has been and could be?
The American Eagle weeps as it soars.
Other than in the Science Fiction minds of George Soros and Maurice Strong, America, leader of the Free World, is not Barack Hussein Obama’s to sign away.
The vision of a One World Government is the sick dream of faceless global elitists and the nightmare of world citizens who prefer freedom to serfdom.
What is about to take place in Copenhagen is what Ronald Reagan, one of America’s most beloved presidents, warned the Free World about in 1964.
It is time to send the constitution experts to the books searching the laws of the land to stop Obama from sending America—and the Free World which would follow—into oblivion.
The person America needs most is the person who was one of those closest to Reagan. That person is Mark Levin, one of American’s preeminent conservative commentators and celebrated constitutional lawyers.
Author of The Book For Our Times, the #1 New York Times bestselling book Liberty and Tyranny, Levin has served as a top advisor to several members of President Ronald Reagan’s Cabinet—including chief of Staff to the Attorney General of the United States. In 2001, the American Conservative Union named Mark Levin the recipient of the prestigious Ronald Reagan Award. Currently practicing law in the private sector, few know more about the Constitution than Mark Levin, who today heads up the Landmark Legal Foundation in Washington, DC.
In jeopardy of imminent betrayal by their own Commander in Chief, America leans on the memory of Reagan for inspiration in this dark chapter.
America now needs Mark Levin to defend its constitution.
Throw a legal constitutional injunction at Obama before he signs America over to the United Nations of One World Government.
The Copenhagen clock is ticking.
To borrow the words of another American hero: Let’s roll!”

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 0 replies

HR 45

2009-11-12T17:56:37Z

The whittlers are whittling away at your rights all the damn time

http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h45/text

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 1 reply

Quote of the moment 11/10/09

2009-11-10T21:50:03Z

"The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by so doing.” ~ Adolf Hitler, dinner talk on April 11, 1942

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 1 reply

in the PRC you gotta leave Bio- identifiers

2009-11-09T16:34:46Z

to buy ammo.
Schwarzenegger recently signed it into law.

What the hell will you leaving bio identity information do to prevent crime?

While it's possible to determine which manufacturer made a certain bullet it's not possible to tell which box it was sold in.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 4 replies

more on mosins

2009-11-09T16:07:57Z

Once again - for your entertainment.....and enlightenment -

AR15: You can pick off prairie dogs at 300 meters all day long
AK47: You can pick off a deer pretty easy at 300 meters
Mosin-Nagant: You get out of your truck, see an elk on top of a hill, and realize you really can use iron sights that far.

AR15: You measure your misses by sub MOA measurements
AK47: You miss and, and aim a bit lower this time.
Mosin-Nagant: Even if you miss the shockwave of the bullet will kill the animal.

AR15: You are careful to keep in clean in the field.
AK47: You don't worry so much about some dirt getting in it.
Mosin-Nagant: It still has gritty grease inside it from when the Finnish army put it into storage.

AR15: Your bayonet will do an alright job of butchering your kill if needed.
AK47: The bayonet doubles as a decent hunting knife.
Mosin-Nagant: Your bayonet can be used to spit roast an entire pig.

AR15: Nice and light for carrying over obstructions.
AK47: Handy package for carrying over obstructions.
Mosin-Nagant: You can pole vault over obstructions.

AR15: Can't run dry or you get seizure.
AK47: Can run dry, but may cause lacquered ammo to stick in chamber.
Mosin-Nagant: Just handling the bolt gives it enough oil to operate smoothly.

What your wife does after she finds out you spent the tax refund / stimulus payment on a -
AR15: She yells at you for spending the whole thing on a plastic varmint rifle.
AK47: She is disappointed at what an ugly rifle you spent half of it on.
Mosin-Nagant: She doesn’t even notice the Mosin-Nagant because of the diamond ring you got her with all the left over cash.

AR15: Melts IN the fire
AK47: Starts ON fire
Mosin-Nagant: Starts THE fire

AR15: With a custom barrel, Varmint Scope, and gunsmith trigger job, you can vaporize prairie dogs at 600 yards.
AK47: With a good rain, you can wait hidden in the mud at the side of a watering hole and wait for the game to come to you for a shot within 10 yards.
Mosin-Nagant: With a solid shooting position, you can hit that deer on the other side of the valley... and recover the bullet in the tree it was standing in front of.

AR15: You can buy 100 round magazines that require dry-carbon lubricant.
AK47: You can do push-ups on your 30 round steel mag (Saw this in a SPETSNATZ documentary).
Mosin-Nagant: You can use the buttstock to pound in a tent stake and if you don't have tent stakes, the bayonet will work as one.

AR-15: Carried by elite special forces and highly-trained American soldiers
AK-47: Carried by illiterate peons and unwilling conscripts.
Mosin-Nagant: Carried by Vassily Zaitsev.

AR15: Might just stop that charging terrorist with a three round burst
AK47: Would stop the terrorist in his tracks
Mosin-Nagant: Would stop the charging terrorist, his three buddies, and blow up the IED in the next block from the shockwave of the bullet...

AR15: Shoots a .22.
AK47: Shoots a carbine round.
Mosin-Nagant: Shoots a cannonball.

AR15: Shot by the free world
AK47: Shot at the free world
Mosin-Nagant: Almost free to shoot

AR15: Shoot it in the air it goes a mile
AK47: Shoot it in the air it goes 1/2 a mile
Mosin-Nagant: Shoot it in the air and someone in Berlin gets hit by a bullet.

AR15: Made out of used cars and recycled milk jugs
AK47: Made out of oil rigs and packing crates
Mosin-Nagant: Made out of old water pipe and goat carts

AR15: Sounds like a pop gun
AK47: Sounds like a machine gun
Mosin-Nagant: Sounds like the Trinity Atomic Blast

AR15: Sometimes mistaken for a toy
AK47: Sometimes mistaken for random parts
Mosin-Nagant: Sometimes mistaken for an artillery piece, or an anti-aircraft gun

AR15: Pray (it works) and spray
AK47: Spray and pray (you hit something)
Mosin-Nagant: The hammer of God

AR15: Makes grown men laugh.
AK47: Makes grown men cry.
Mosin-Nagant: Makes grown men incontinent.

AR15: Finicky when dirty.
AK47: Still works when dirty.
Mosin-Nagant: Arrives Dirty from the Distributor.

AR15: Don’t run over it...it will Break
AK47: Run over it, it still shoots.
Mosin-Nagant: Run over it and it will flatten your Tires!

AR15: Makes a Pop when fired
AK47: Makes a Boom when fired
Mosin-Nagant: What the hell was that???

AR15: Ok, I got One!
AK47: Ok, I have 3 different ones.
Mosin-Nagant: Ok, I have Mosin-itis and have 14 and looking for More....

AR15: Makes a small hole in a tree
AK47: Makes a medium sized hole in a tree
Mosin-Nagant: Blows tree in half making firewood available.

AR15: Kills rabbits and coyotes
AK47: Kills pigs and small deer
Mosin-Nagant: If you can’t kill it with a Mosin-Nagant, it can’t be killed

AR15: Safe to stow in poly bags
AK47: Safe to stow in a rice paddy
Mosin-Nagant: Safe to stow in a landfill

AR15: 100 round beta c drum mags you can load with a speed loader
AK47: 75 round drum magazine you have to reload individually by pressing a lever
Mosin-Nagant: You can store 20 of them in a drum with about 1000 rounds on stripper clips

AR15: Has a nice Airsoft copy
AK47: Has a nice Airsoft copy
Mosin-Nagant: Who needs Airsoft when you can fire blanks.

AR15: Makes a nice paperweight
AK47: Makes a nice doorstop
Mosin-Nagant: Makes a nice baseball bat and way cheaper then aluminum

AR15: Loyal following of people that have more money than sense.
AK47: Loyal following of people that have a longer police record than the range of the rifle.
Mosin-Nagant: Loyal following of people that have more rounds of ammo than they got hairs on all family members' heads combined.

AR-15: Your enemies will giggle
AK-47: Your enemies will take cover and swear as they ready their weapons
Mosin-Nagant: Your enemies will flatten themselves to the ground and offer up prayers of salvation to whatever god they believe in...then they will die.

AR-15: Drop it from ten feet and it shatters.
AK-47: Drop it from ten feet and it still works.
Mosin-Nagant: Drop it from ten feet and it's more lethal than a lawn dart.

AR-15: You can melt it with a magnifying glass.
AK-47: Under a magnifying glass, you can see the ingrained dirt.
Mosin-Nagant: Under a magnifying glass, you can see the soaked-in BLOOD.

AR-15: Safe, Semiautomatic, Full-Auto (more like full-JAM)
AK-47: Safe(dubious), Semiautomatic, Full-Auto
Mosin-Nagant: Kill, Maim, Destroy

AR-15: When you run out of ammo, duck for cover and spend 15 minutes cleaning and reloading
AK-47: You could probably rig it up to fire chain-linked ammo
Mosin-Nagant: When you run out of ammo (never) you can shoot chaff and langrage from it (wikipedia that)

AR-15: My daddy bought me this weapon for my birthday
AK-47: I saved two weeks' paychecks to buy this.
Mosin-Nagant: I think it was free...

AR-15: My rifle floated away in the flood
AK-47: My rifle was submerged for three weeks by the flood and still works
Mosin-Nagant: I fired my rifle and the flood waters parted...

AR15: You keep your bayonet in the kitchen because it is a good steak knife
AK47: You keep your bayonet in your toolbox because it is a good wire cutter
Mosin-Nagant: You no longer fix your bayonet in the house because the last time you did you poked a hole in the ceiling when you stood up

AR15: For $1000 you can get one
AK47: For $1000 you can get two and 300 rounds of ammo
Mosin-Nagant: For $1000 you can get 16 of them plus a Bulgarian armory's worth of surplus ammo

AR15: Can start brush fires with incendiary ammunition.
AK47: Can start brush fires by dropping it after the handguard catches fire.
Mosin-Nagant: Can start brush fires by firing from anything lower than a kneeling position.

AR15: Built with custom parts, nice trigger, all the bells and whistles $1500+
AK47: Modified with aftermarket and 1,000 rounds of ammo not even $1500
Mosin-Nagant: Stock, with 1,000 rounds maybe $300, meaning you get $1200 to spend on more beer

AR15: Takes a few men out in a sweeper movement
AK47: Takes most men out in a sweeper movement
Mosin-Nagant: Shoot one the sonic boom will handle the rest

AR15: Used in negotiations
AK47: Reason for negotiations
Mosin-Nagant: Negotiator

AR15: I think I felt it kick
AK47: Kinda like a 20 guage
Mosin-Nagant: Dislocation
Mosin-Nagant with heavy ball: Where's my freaking shoulder

AR15: Takes 3 rounds to take out your enemy
AK47: takes 30 rounds sprayed and hopefully you hit your target
Mosin-Nagant: 1 shot, 50 kills

AR15: More options than a custom Rolls-Royce. No two guns are alike.
AK47: Same number of options as a Toyota Corolla. Most guns look alike.
Mosin-Nagant: Options: You want a bayonet with that?

The limits of customizing a-
AR15: How much $ you got.
AK47: What you can find in the Tapco catalog.
Mosin-Nagant: How much duct tape Bubba's got.

AR15: Such light recoil, you could put on over your balls and fire.
AK47: Recoil manageable enough for anyone to use it.
Mosin-Nagant: Recoil that registers as small tremors in the earth itself.

AR15: Bullet starts tumbling the moment it meets sufficient resistance, like paper
AK47: Bullet will continue trajectory until it hits something solid, like a deer
Mosin-Nagant: It keeps going and going and going....

AR15: You probably drive a Lexus
AK47: If you're lucky to possess a vehicle, it's referred to as a "Technical"
Mosin-Nagant: You hang truck-balls off your trailer hitch, and you're proud of them.

AR15: Lots of fancy optics available
AK47: You can bolt some stuff to the side
Mosin-Nagant: Who cares about optics when the barrel is long enough to smack the enemy over the head without even leaving your foxhole.

AR15: Used by Special Forces to kill terrorists
AK47: Used by revolutionaries and any two bit nation's illiterate conscripts to kill each other
Mosin-Nagant: Used by Simo Häyhä to kill Russian conscripts

AR15: Requires over 1000 rounds to break in
AK47: May need some breaking in
Mosin-Nagant: The stripper clips require more breaking in

AR15: Can take down smaller sized game.
AK47: Can take down average sized game.
Mosin-Nagant: Can take down satellites.

AR15: Invented 50 years ago by a consummate engineer
AK47: Invented 60 years ago by wounded tank sergeant
Mosin-Nagant: Invented 117 years ago by two drunks on a budget.

AR15: Star wars
AK47: Holy wars
Mosin-Nagant: Class wars

AR15: Makes small holes
AK47: Makes big holes
Mosin-Nagant: Makes black holes

AR15: Nice lightweight ammo can be carried in quantity.
AK47: You can carry a chest pouch with lots of mags with no problem.
Mosin-Nagant: Ammo is also used in tanks, and larger artillery pieces.

Domestic uses of the bayonet:
AR15: You affix it to your rifle and use it as a dibble to plant tulip bulbs in the garden.
AK47: You affix it to your rifle and use it to trim low-hanging tree branches.
Mosin-Nagant: You affix it to your rifle, accidentally stab it into the ceiling and bring down a square foot of plaster, and spend the next week sleeping on the couch because your wife is pissed off at you.

AR15: Comes in Pink Hello Kitty and Barbie
AK47: Comes in Pink Hello Kitty
Mosin-Nagant: What’s pink?

AR15: Iran-Contra was a cover-up
AK47: Afghanistan (1980) was a cover-up
Mosin-Nagant: Chernobyl was a cover-up

You call the thing with the ammo in it a "clip" and...
AR15: Your buddies glare at you and don't speak to you for a month.
AK47: Your buddies smile at you with their gold teeth and "blast another cap."
Mosin-Nagant: Your buddies smile at you because it's one of the few times you all get to call something a "clip"... and be right.

AR15: Clean with fancy lubes and solvents with special tools.
AK47: Clean? In Soviet Russia AK clean you!
Mosin-Nagant: Squirt some Windex down the bore. Ready for another 500 rounds tomorrow!

AR15: You can be an expert with this rifle after basic training
AK47: You can be an expert with this rifle after a seminar at the Holiday Inn on AKs
Mosin-Nagant: You can be an expert with this rifle after spending 30 minutes on the internet reading forums, and watching YouTube videos

AR15: Can shoot a squirrel and have a great meal
AK47: Can shoot a squirrel and have some meat left to eat.
Mosin-Nagant: There is a tail left around here somewhere.

AR15: Puts some countries air force to shame
AK47: Used by countries who can’t afford an air force
Mosin-Nagant: Could be used to take down an air force

AR15: Shoot one and you'll be owning one soon!
AK47: Shoot one and you will buy some high capacity magazines and 1000 rounds of ammo
Mosin-Nagant: Shoot one and you will own 15 and want another!

AR15: Goes pew pew pew
AK47: Goes pow pow pow
Mosin-Nagant: Goes BOOOOOOOM!

AR15: Made by a stoned Eugene
AK47: Made by an injured Kalashnikov
Mosin-Nagant: Made by a drunken Belgian and a crazy Ivan

Owners drink of choice
AR15: Cognac
AK47: Malt liquor
Mosin-Nagant: Brake cleaner

AR15: Makes a tiny hole with no fragmentation or undue extra injury, in accordance with the Geneva Convention
AK47: Makes a big hole and sometimes flings severed body parts around, not in accordance with the Geneva Convention
Mosin-Nagant: One of the reasons the Geneva Convention was written

AR15: Can shoot it off your head and it won't kill you
AK47: Shoot it off your head and you die
Mosin-Nagant: Shoot if from your shoulder and you need it popped back into place

AR15: Used to kill Enemies of the State.
AK47: Used by Enemies of the State.
Mosin-Nagant: Enemy at the Gates.

AR15: Good for shooting poodles.
AK47: Good for shooting enemies of the state
Mosin-Nagant: Good for shooting light armored vehicles

AR15: Keeps gunsmiths in business
AK47: Keeps drug dealers and terrorists in business
Mosin-Nagant: Keeps Chiropractors in business

AR15: Built like a Toy.
AK47: Built like a Sewing Machine.
Mosin-Nagant: Built like a Tank!

AR15: Too much Plastic.
AK47: Too Much Sheet metal.
Mosin-Nagant: Too much of everything!

AR15: stays in the Vault.
AK47: not allowed in the vault.
Mosin-Nagant: Can be used to Pole Vault!

AR15: In your Heart you think it's ugly.
AR15: In your Heart you know it's ugly.
Mosin-Nagant: You're afraid to call it ugly!

AR15: It doesn't go anywhere near <shudder> water... Unless you're drinking Evian
AK47: If water touches it, it would mistake it for a cleaning solvent and fall apart
Mosin-Nagant: Row-row-row your boat, gently down the Volga...

AR15: If it gets in the Mekong River, you need to clean it before firing.
AK47: If it gets in the Mekong River, shake the water out before firing.
Mosin-Nagant: Used as an oar to paddle up and down the Mekong river

AR15: Used to attack soldiers building a bridge across the Mekong
AK47: Used to protect soldiers building a bridge across the Mekong
Mosin-Nagant: Used to actually build the bridge across the Mekong.

AR15: Plastics make it possible
AK47: Sheet metal make it possible
Mosin-Nagant: Driftwood makes it possible

AR15: Nice useful little round.
AK47: Very functional round.
Mosin-Nagant: Anti Tank Round

AR15: Useful against unarmored foe
AK47: Useful against armored foe
Mosin-Nagant: Useful against foe on the other side of the battlefield!

AR15: Useful for hosing down forward edge of the battle area...
AK47: Useful for hosing down sky over forward edge of the battle area...
Mosin-Nagant: Useful for hosing down rear of the battle area, enemy reserves and basic training camps at home...

AR15: Thousands of moving parts, held together by hundreds of bolts, screws, and precision welds.
AK47: Several dozen moving parts, held together by a few screws and some drunken Ivan's light-sabering with an acetylene torch.
Mosin-Nagant: TWO MOVING PARTS. TWO SCREWS. .

AR15: Owner votes for John McCain
AK47: Owner prays for Barack Hussein Osama
Mosin-Nagant: Owner can overthrow the government no matter who becomes president.

AR15: One tenth the firepower at 10 times the price
AK47: Half the Firepower at twice the price
Mosin-Nagant: 10 times the firepower at one tenth the price

AR15: Turns little rocks into pebbles
AK47: Turns big rocks into little rocks
Mosin-Nagant: Makes molehills out of mountains

AR15: One inch groups at 100 yards.
AK47: Five to six inch groups at 100 yards.
Mosin-Nagant: Muzzle is one inch from target at 100 yards.

AR15: Designs drawn on blueprint paper by stoner and a team of experts in a R&D facility
AK47: Designs drawn on notebook paper by Kalashnikov in a Soviet hospital
Mosin-Nagant: Designs drawn on cocktail napkins by a drunken Sergei Mosin-Nagant in a bar

AR15: Clean with a bunch of cloths, patches, picks, brushes and don't lose the small parts. Clean every 100 rounds.
AK47: Run a patch down the barrel; wipe out the chamber every few months.
Mosin-Nagant: Throw it in the dishwasher every couple years.

AR15: New shooters love it because of good ergonomics and light recoil.
AK47: New shooters love it because of light recoil.
Mosin-Nagant: New shooters required to sign a waiver-absolving owner of physical damage incurred from recoil

AR15: Usually equipped with flash hider to reduce muzzle flash.
AK47: Can be equipped with flash hider to reduce muzzle flash.
Mosin-Nagant: Muzzle flash can be used to summon the mother ship.

AR15: Can be used to defend home against crooks
AK47: Can be used to defend Oil Tanker against Pirates
Mosin-Nagant: Can replace one of the Deck Guns on the Kirov Class Battle cruiser

AR-15: Defenders
AK-47: Invaders
Mosin-Nagant: Victors

AR15: High cost, high maintenance.
AK47: Low cost, low maintenance.
Mosin-Nagant: What are these cost and maintenance things you speak of?

AR15: Your rifle takes a few hours to sight in, starting at 50 yard and moving up to 200, making minute adjustments with a small screwdriver.
AK47: You slide your rear sight around until you hit the target.
Mosin-Nagant: You hit your rifle with a hammer to sight it.

AR15: Arm of the free world
AK47: Arm of everybody else
Mosin-Nagant: Arm of Chuck Norris

AR15: Politicians fear it.
AK47: Media fears it.
Mosin-Nagant: Zombies fear it!

At an indoor range.
AR15: Gets people's attention because of its wonderful accuracy.
AK47: Gets people's attention because of its rugged reliability.
Mosin-Nagant: Gets people's attention because muzzle flash sets off sprinkler system!

As for accurizing.
AR15: You buy match grade components installed by professional gunsmith and spend thousands of dollars.
AK47: You buy GOOD ammo and optics and spend hundreds of dollars.
Mosin-Nagant: You use an empty soda can, some sand paper and spend seven bucks!

AR15: You can put one hole in a paper target at 100 meters with 30 rounds.
AK47: You can put a .30" hole through 12" of oak, if you can hit it.
Mosin-Nagant: You can knock down everyone else's target with the shock wave of your bullet going downrange.

AR15: When out of ammo, your rifle makes a great whiffle bat.
AK47: When out of ammo your rifle will nominally pass as a club.
Mosin-Nagant: When out of ammo, your rifle makes a supreme war club, pike, boat oar, tent pole, or firewood.

AR15: What's recoil?
AK47: Recoil is manageable, even fun.
Mosin-Nagant: Recoil is often used to relocate shoulders thrown out by the previous shot.

AR15: Your sight adjustment is incremented in fractions of minute of angle.
AK47: Your sight adjustment goes to "10", and you've never bothered moving it.
Mosin-Nagant: Your sight adjustment goes to 12 miles and you've actually tried it.

AR15: After a day at the range, you detail strip your rifle and thoroughly clean and lubricate it with only the best products.
AK47: After a day of shooting out back you run a quick patch through the bore and throw your rifle in the back of your truck.
Mosin-Nagant: Cleaning....and maintenance?

AR15: Millennium Falcon
AK47: Star Destroyer
Mosin-Nagant: The Death Star

As for accessories.
AR15: You have a never ending list of high dollar tacti-cool accessories.
AK47: You have a never ending list of Chinese made tacti-cool accessories.
Mosin-Nagant: You have carry strap and ammo what more you need comrade?

AR15: Cost a lot of money
AK47: Cost some money
Mosin-Nagant: free with purchase of bayonet

AR15: Backordered.
AK47: Backordered.
Mosin-Nagant: Mail ordered.

AR15: When out of ammo you would rather die than risk damaging your $1200 rifle buy using it as a club.
AK47: When out of ammo your rifle makes a nice club.
Mosin-Nagant: Your rifle is a club that can shoot people.

AR15: When on patrol in Vietnam ammo is so light you can carry around 900 rounds of ammo with you.
AK47: When patrolling your warlord's territory, you carry all the ammo you need in the back of a technical.
Mosin-Nagant: When sent to battle at Stalingrad you are only issued a stripper clip of ammunition and told that you would find your rifle laying on the ground.

AR15: Got it by joining army
AK47: Got it with one paycheck
Mosin-Nagant: Got it by saving beer cans

On prairie dogs:
AR15: You sit back with your buddies poopin them all day long 651hits 3 misses.
AK47: You and another person go to a dog-town fire 4,000 rounds and each get one because they were 8 feet away and deaf.
Mosin-Nagant: You go with 3 other people get the first shot at the first P-dog you see and wipe out the entire colony, leaving a crater that the people who find it claim was a meteor impact.

Regarding muzzle blast:
AR15: Makes a popping sound that is hardly noticed at a public range.
AK47: Makes a hearty boom that usually gets noticed at a public range.
Mosin-Nagant: Makes the Earth tremble and two guys in Bavaria look at each other and ask "vat da hell vas dat?!"

AR15: Looks like a toy
AK47: Looks cobbled together from spare parts
Mosin-Nagant: Looks like a Kentucky Musket of DOOM!

AR15: Sworn at by three generations of American soldiers and Marines
AK47: Brought back as a proof of kill by Carlos Hathcock
Mosin-Nagant: Carried by Samo Hayho, Vasili Ziatsev and feared on both sides of the battle line in the hands of snipers.

AR15: Flash suppressed, super stealthy
AK47: Why worry about stealth when you and your comrades can pour a wall of lead onto the enemy?
Mosin-Nagant: Blinds anybody within 150 meters who's not wearing welding goggles.

AR15: Can use the bayonet to whittle
AK47: Can use the bayonet to kill an enemy or butcher food
Mosin-Nagant: Bayonet used to cut the sheet metal parts they use to make AR's and AK's

AR15: Underslung grenade launcher can take out a dug-in enemy at 300 meters
AK47: Underslung grenade launcher makes a lot of noise and a huge dirt crater
Mosin-Nagant: Who needs grenades when your bullets are so big they can kill tanks?

AR15: Inspired by science fiction
AK47: Inspired by a need for a reliable, selectable-fire weapon
Mosin-Nagant: Inspired by men with balls. Men with HUGE, HAIRY BALLS

AR15: Comprised of several hundred moving parts, usually falls victim to Murphy's law
AK47: Comprised of as few moving parts as possible, almost impossible to break unless something goes REALLY REALLY WRONG (which might IMPROVE the accuracy)
Mosin-Nagant: Has only one moving part, is held together by only two screws, and damned well outshoots both of the above.

AR15: Rust is your mortal enemy; you clean your gun five times a day.
AK47: Rust might become a problem in a few years; you clean your gun once a month.
Mosin-Nagant: Rust makes your rifle look more authentic.

AR15: You clean your rifle with molecularly engineered precision $1000-ounce synthetic lubricant
AK47: WD-40 is acceptable
Mosin-Nagant: If everything else runs out you can clean your rifle with your own pee

With regard to sound volume:
AR15: Suitable for use with a sound suppressor because its tiny bullet is already quiet.
AK47: No need for a sound suppressor because the enemy will be flat on the ground with their hands over their ears, hiding from the sheer volume of fire.
Mosin-Nagant: You don't need a sound suppressor, because after the first shot the enemy will be totally deaf anyway.

How long does it take to learn to care for your rifle?
AR15: It will take a drill sergeant about a week to teach you what you need to know about how to disassemble, reassemble and maintain your rifle.
AK47: A good gunnery sergeant can teach you how to care for one in about 4 hours.
Mosin-Nagant: You can learn how to take it apart and put it back together in about 15 minutes with the manual and a couple of YouTube videos in front of you.

AR15: Must be carefully cleaned every 100 rounds or so.
AK47: Only have to worry about cleaning if using Wolf ammo
Mosin-Nagant: Cleaning? Consists of getting liquored up on vodka and peeing down the barrel to get rid of corrosive salts from milsurp primers.

AR15: Opened by pushing 2 pins
AK47: Opened with a swift kick
Mosin-Nagant: Opened with a 2X4 and a ball peen hammer

AR15: Mostly made out of expensive polymers
AK47: Mostly made out of cheap stamped metal and particle board
Mosin-Nagant: Mostly made out of "whatever the f*ck the comrades could find lying around the People's Factory"

AR15: can probably put together a nice one, due to the popularity of ownership, for under $1,000
AK47: Can probably get a decent one, or refurbished one, for under $500.
Mosin-Nagant: Can probably buy rifle, 440 rounds of ammo, and a case of Windex for under $200.

AR15: Won't work unless you clean it every day
AK47: Should be cleaned at least once a year
Mosin-Nagant: Was last cleaned by a Russian conscript in Berlin in 1945

AR15: If the firing pin breaks you send it to the factory for repairs
AK47: If the firing pin breaks you buy a new one
Mosin-Nagant: If the firing pin breaks you just screw it deeper into the bolt

AR15: Your accessories cost more than the rifle
AK47: All your accessories cost around $300
Mosin-Nagant: All your accessories come free with the rifle

AR15: Accountant's Rifle
AK47: Factory Worker's Rifle
Mosin-Nagant: If you can fill out an application, you can probably already afford it

AR15: Tax return will get it
AK47: Tax return will get you 2 plus mags
Mosin-Nagant: Tax Return will get you a case plus enough ammo to last you till doomsday

AR15: Made when jet passenger flight was fairly regular
AK47: Made when knowing how to fly could make you an officer
Mosin-Nagant: Made when hot air balloons were considered the ultimate flight technology

AR15: Buttstock is collapsible, only used to aid in shooting the rifle
AK47: Buttstock is also good for knocking some oppressor's teeth out
Mosin-Nagant: Buttstock is good for use as a sledgehammer, crutch, club, or boat oar

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 4 replies

CZ-82 9x18

2009-11-09T15:22:07Z

Just got my C&R FFL a couple of months ago. My first purchase was a CZ-82 9x18. Took it apart and made sure everything was kosher and went straight to the range. The first 2 rounds hit about 5 inches low and center. Then after looking further I discovered that the site paint had worn off and the sites needed to align where the paint would be normally. Fortunately I had some paint with me so I just used a twisted peice of paper towel to apply the paint. Every shot hit center after that and what a comfortable little pocket shooter it was. One of the best $200.00 I have spent in a long time. And, the ammo is still readily available and the price isn't bad either.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 7 replies

Taurus Judge?

2009-10-28T19:07:47Z

does anyone have any experience with this pistol? Chambered for 410 and 45 caliber. .

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 1 reply

Broken bolt

2009-10-28T14:57:05Z

The lever on my bolt broke off! The gun is a springfield 1903 A-3 sported, when the stock and scope were instaled, they had to modify
the bolt lever so it wouldnt hit the scope. (all done before I aquired the gun) Now its in the shop getting re welded!

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 7 replies

How come

2009-10-11T06:54:17Z

i cant help but wonder why my thompson center hawken, a primative caplock, when loaded with ball and patch out shoots my mosin nagant sniper rifle at 100 yards, i can put in groups with the hawken that cut each others holes at 100yrds but a 2 inch group with the Mosin,and thats not usin mil surp ammo,but new manufacture. any ideas?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 6 replies

Thinkin abbout gettin one of these

2009-10-11T06:41:25Z

anybody have a psl? Ive got lots of 7.62x54 and im dyin to try one of these, any thoughts?
http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/Romanian_PSL-54C_7.62x54R_Rifle.html

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

M16,Aks. and Mosin Nagants

2009-09-28T21:14:49Z

Check this out its great http://minionreport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=36039

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 1 reply

you may have seen this...

2009-09-26T17:24:03Z

http://www.santacruzsentinel.com/nationalbreaking/ci_13145541

I found it an entertaining read

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 6 replies

Range Report

2009-08-27T13:53:52Z

I got a good deal on a hand r .22/22 mag revolver. case hardened frame, dbl action, and side gate loading. this gun went out of production in 1977 but it looks new, even the box and handbook are in great shape. i put 200 rounds through it with no problems. it shoots a little high but i may just file down the front sight a bit to help that. actually i like this gum much better than my old style ruger single six.i may just sell it as ive been offered 3 times what i paid for it. after buyin it i found out that it was a 1956 production the first year of the single six, so i may just let that one go. i really like the h and r

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

National CCW is on the table

2009-08-12T20:24:05Z

Arlen Spectre and a few others are examining the notion of a national concealed permit. Don';t get your hopes up, it is all still in the exploratory stage.

Actually I have mixed feelings on this. On one hand it would be nice to have a single permit to travel the state.
On the other, it is trampling on state's rights. One of the great things about our 50 states is that they are different. That's why people live in CT or TX or the PRK; because they like it there. They like the laws, the way of life, etc, etc.

As much as I would not mind a national permit (though I am sketchy about the feds handling it...) I have always hated the do-gooders who decide they have to foist their beliefs on others by taking their local issue to the federal level. Gay marriage for instance, Marriage has always been a state's issue to govern, yet there has been a lot of pushing for a federal law on the matter. Abortion never should have been determined by the supreme court, it was a state's issue medical care is typically a state governed thing.)

How do you all weigh in on a national CCW permit? Does it sound like a gun registration scheme or a good idea?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

So they will now allow guns in Fed properties and parks.

2009-08-06T02:48:49Z

This really troubles me. I can't tell you how much I find this terrifying.
I mean, I always knew and counted on the fact that I could even stake my life on the fact that no matter how bad assed the Gangster types were that were chasing me with guns blazing that I could duck into any Post Office or National park and be safe.

And now they have stripped that away from me.

Woe is me what now shall I do?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 4 replies

Obama's Gun plans exposed finally

2009-08-06T02:36:56Z

I predicted months ago that Obama would use the border wars as grounds to ban guns in some way. Just in today's paper a statement from the ATF claims that 90% of the guns confiscated by Mexico from cartel members were not purchased through legal dealers. The ATF believes that the guns are obtained at gun shows or American black market. The ATF stressed the fact that they were able to achieve this by tracing the guns, a critical need of theirs.

There, they said it pretty much. Obama will start with a registration program. Low profile, they will start registering new sales, then expand it to include guns you have had for years based on some wierd definition of an assault weapon. It worked so well for the Germans in 1938.

The problem with this, is that buried under the headlines the sample of 20000 weapons traced was hand selected by the Mexican police before being sent to us. They had confiscated 120000 guns total, but we were only allowed to trace 20k of them. Based on this fragment of the data, the Obama administration will champion a quiet little layered gun registration bill. You watch and see.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 7 replies

Brought my gun to church today

2009-08-06T02:29:35Z

As usual when I went to church tonight i had my P90 inna shoulder rig. with the church shootings goin on in the past 2 yrs i started bringin my gun in instead of leavin it in the truck. I use the .45 becaus i practice with that gun at long range ( for a pistol) and if im sittin in the center of the sanctuary i can hit any of the 5 doors comin in, and the entire area is in a comfortable range for me, well after church i was talkin to the Pastr and he went to slap me on the back, as he did this he felt my shoulder rig, then he looked at me and said "thank you, Im glad to know you have that" Its a cryin shame when I feel like I need to carry my gun in my Lords house to worship. I dont carry it to make a point. like other ppl are doin, or to exercise my rights, but because I believe its nessessary to the saftey of my family, and our church. and to be honest it botheres me a lot that the world has come to a point where I have to carry in church

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

New gunz

2009-08-06T02:24:23Z

So I got a couple of new guns. I got a 3030 levergun, and a Star 1911 clone (or near clone) and an old Nylon 22. The Star fed three mags without a jam so I loaded it up with ball ammo and slapped it into a fake book on a shelf. The levergun I already took camping.

I have been busy reloading all the components I had been buying for years during the days of plenty ammo. I just found a good 105gr load for my 243, and the 110 grain Speer JSPs hit sharpley to point of aim in my Blackhawk.

I went looking for Saltpeter and sulpher at a drug store and they did not sell any. They said to go to the feed store?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 9 replies

Gun challenge

2009-07-18T03:23:45Z

Thought y'all might find this interesting:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montana_Firearms_Freedom_Act

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

Bring your gun to church day

2009-07-18T03:14:33Z

Frankly, I think this is stupid. I carry, and I'm not ashamed of it. But the church has nothing to do with it, and neither SHOULD the church have anything to do with it. I'm not sure why this should even make the news.

http://www.wlky.com/news/19648931/detail.html

http://www.whas11.com/news/local/stories/whas11-topstory-090603-guns-in-church.44e1b2fe.html

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 5 replies

Obama's game plan for taking your guns

2009-07-18T03:07:20Z

I think that Obama may have revealed part of his gun confiscation plans with his recent focus on the border wars. I have a feeling that he will use the cartel wars along the US-Mex border the same way that W used 9-11 to encroach on our rights. With his wide support he will be able to get pretty far before the NRA can slow him down.

Somehow Obama will find a way to justify additional border searches (going to Mexico) in the name of homeland security.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 7 replies

Earplugs

2009-07-09T02:40:53Z

I use (and like) the disposable foam earplugs. Anyone got a recommendation for a non-disposable variety? I've seen a plethora of "high-tech," hard-plastic earplugs on the market and wonder if any of them really work.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 10 replies

most know this already

2009-06-14T05:23:41Z

but just had to share..

http://www.vimeo.com/3923535

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

practice

2009-05-23T02:23:44Z

practice practice practice, we all need range time. but shells are gettin expensive. i wouldlike to encourage ppl to get more .22s. I am still gettin plenty of range time, without the expense of shooting one of my larger caliber guns. every time i go to the store, even for bread or milk. i pick up another box of bulk .22. 550 rds for 12 buks, try it yall

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 11 replies

Husqvarna Shotgun

2009-05-23T02:21:47Z

I didn't know Husky made anything but chainsaws... apparently, I don't know everything...yet.

I'm seriously thinking about this late 1920's (or so they tell me) husqvarna, double barrel side-by-side with external hammers. They call the forearm a 'sliver' I guess. And it has an under-latch to crack open the action, not a top thumb-latch like the coach guns I'm used to.

It locks up nice and tight, all the parts seem to be in great condition and the price was knocked way down for some cosmetic 'wear and tear' which is fine, I really enjoy a good cosmetic restoration project. The tag $199 but the register said $179, there were two other similar acquisitions from the same private collection, but in better cosmetic shape (although one was poorer condition mechanically) each going for $250

The one downside I can see is that my online research points strongly toward these guns all having a 2 1/2 inch chamber with a short forcing cone. Some sources say you're fine having a gunsmith open it to 2 3/4 and lengthening the forcing cone, other sources say that is unsafe in some guns.

What is your experience or uncle's experience with Husqvarna shotguns? What do you know about lengthening the breech in a shotgun?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 4 replies

Kill the gun

2009-05-20T14:54:40Z

A friend on facebook just sent me this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGp-LxLYvRc

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

Quote Of The Moment (May 13, 2009)

2009-05-18T17:59:08Z

Democracy is two wolves and a lamb deciding what to have for dinner. Liberty is a well-armed lamb." ~ Benjamin Franklin

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 1 reply

a BB gun?

2009-05-17T18:56:11Z

GAINESVILLE — Authorities say a 21-year-old aspiring rapper robbed a Gainesville convenience store and shot a clerk with a BB gun to gain “street credibility.”

Police say Steven Gilmore Jr. has confessed to the Friday night robbery. He also confessed to a restaurant robbery that occurred last week.

According to the Gainesville police, Gilmore shot the clerk in the temple with a BB gun during the robbery.

Gilmore is being held in the Alachua County jail on robbery and aggravated battery charges. According to the Gainesville Sun, a 16-year-old accomplice was also arrested.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,519816,00.html

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 10 replies

hi cap mags

2009-05-08T02:19:38Z

how much firepower does a person need? I commonly carry a kel tec 9mm. i traded off the .380 b4 ammo for them got scarce, as 9mm are a lot cheaper than .380 anyway and I have other 9mm guns. if i feel the need for somthin bigger I pack a ruger p90, and a spare clip, total of 15 rds.yet my Beretta holds 15 in the clip and 1 up the pike. I prefer the .45 , im confortable with it and i always hit my target., but i was reading one of ferfals blogs about a guy that was usin a gp100 .357 and traded it off because he ran out of ammo inna gunfight/ attempted robbery. should I start carrying somthin with a hi cap mag? I can get a armscor 1911 with double stacks, a friend of mine has em in stock, they take 14 rd mags, ruger doesent have a high cap .45, but my p90 to me is the best .45 i have ever owned. how many rounds do yall carry just goin around town and such?any thoughts on this? thanks Greg

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 13 replies

Quote of the moment:

2009-05-06T22:20:50Z

"Whenever governments mean to invade the rights and liberties of the people, they always attempt to destroy the militia, in order to raise an army upon their ruins." ~ Rep. Elbridge Gerry, 1789

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 4 replies

Something Big?

2009-04-30T00:04:13Z

I'm not sure of the validity of this. Anyone know anything here?

http://patriotsforamerica.ning.com/profiles/blogs/something-big-is-going-on?xgs=1

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 6 replies

My First

2009-04-12T23:40:43Z

Just wanted to thank everyone for the input. After shooting cases full of different guns, I just took delivery of my first pistol:

Kimber TLE 2. Good fit. Powerful. Accurate. Fun to shoot.

Already looking forward to the weekend.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 5 replies

FALs - Metric Vs. Inch Pattern

2009-04-10T13:16:42Z

What advantages does one have over the other, other than availability of parts and mags ? I'm planning on starting a FAL project, like a Para model. Where the Hell do I begin ? On a similar note, my blind ass needs a scope mounted on it, and I hate the aftermarket crap I've seen. Anyone been down this road ?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

Gun Egg Fryer

2009-04-10T03:22:30Z

I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't seen it:

http://laughingsquid.com/wp-content/uploads/gun-egg-fryers.jpg

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

An even swap?

2009-04-10T03:21:18Z

Would you consider a 9mm H&K USP to be of equal value to a Sig P229? Both are used to about the same degree and in excellent condition.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 6 replies

870 EXP 20 ga

2009-04-07T19:07:55Z

I have aan 870 exp 20 ga. that fights me every inch of the way on reassembly, I also have an 870 wingmaster 12 and never have a problem.
Is there something so difernt abou them.....or is the exp just a pice of shit? I just bought the exp, used.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 8 replies

This is disturbing

2009-04-07T03:37:33Z

http://www.newsweek.com/id/183663/page/2

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

Alternative firearm lubrication

2009-04-07T03:35:12Z

Some may recall we were talking about alternate lubrication methods in a couple threads, several months ago. White Lithium Grease was talked about. I took it upon myself to try it out on a few models of guns, and the test results were very positive.

Well, just a quick FYI, they aren't as positive in cold weather. The grease hardens like crayon wax, everything feels stiff and resistive, and I'm sure with enough cold-weather use, the hard lithium would be rubbed or scraped out of key friction points, and could allow damage and wear.

For hot weather, it is acceptable. For cold weather, Thousand Good Intentions gives white lithium grease 'Two thumbs down'.

Anyways, just a quick follow-up since I was too lazy to hunt down the older threads.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 21 replies

Wax

2009-04-02T18:20:19Z

I recently saw an ad for Hornady's "Extreme Defense" ammunition. It seems to have a plastic or wax plug which improves ballistics. This made me wonder: what happens if you fill your own JHPs with a bead of wax? What will that do to ballistics?

And it reminded me of that scene in Jaws, where the Sheriff is filling his ammo with some kind of chemical and topping that off with some wax. What was that all about? (Since bullets disintegrate a foot or two into the water, anyway.)

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 7 replies

Illinois

2009-03-22T22:05:21Z

It would seem Illinois doesn't do much in the way of CCW reciprocity. I'll be traveling there in the not-distant future, and it looks like I won't be carrying...

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 9 replies

P229

2009-03-16T20:33:07Z

I just put about 50 rounds through my P229. I think this thing is my new best friend.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 8 replies

Saiga AK 47

2009-03-16T04:40:36Z

I bought one cheap the other day, shoots pretty good. decent groups at 200 yards

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

Some POSITIVE legislature for a change

2009-03-14T21:26:22Z

Well, if you're in Utah. New law allowing workers to carry guns to work

http://deseretnews.com/article/1,5143,705290063,00.html

And yes. Carrying a loaded gun in your car is fine here, as long as it's not openly visible. No permit required. Openly visible guns are also okay, as I understand it, but they cannot be loaded. Never understood why some people like showing their guns in the truck rack, seems like theft-advertisement to me, but some guys just gotta brag at the cost of all else i suppose.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 0 replies

Militia training

2009-03-08T19:28:00Z

Just some videos here of Militia training. Lots of different groups . Even some heavy equipment. It has been stated that Militias are a bunch of fat beer swillers . I beg to differ. Michael

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 19 replies

Holy shit are people afraid of Obama

2009-03-08T04:03:08Z

The gun market has turned like I have never seen. Shotgun news has 3 pages of guns, and the rest is accessories. Shotgun News! The magazine known for 50 years as the magazine that sells anything that shoots (and tanks, and amphibious vehicles...)

Gun shows are barren, everything is marked up $300. Ammo sells for slightly less than gold, and even if you have the cash it is tricky to get hold of anything specialized.

Obama and his new AG Holder are driving gun owners crazy. Although I feel that Holder will turn the ATF into the gestapo, I don't expect any serious legislation out of Obama until his second term (after he is reelected.) He will not be anxious to face the entrenched NRA. They cost Gore and Kerry the election.

What are all of you seeing in your areas?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 32 replies

Kel Tec

2009-02-23T23:19:14Z

http://www.kel-tec-cnc.com/rfb.htm

I've read about it. I see the diagram. I must say that I am interested. I am skeptical about the forward ejection though. Any thoughts?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

45-70 load

2009-02-22T06:02:37Z

Anyone have a favorite load for a 400gr LRN 45-70. As soon as I finish this bobcat skeleton. It's been backlogging my workbench for two years.

Anyone load Colt 38? Not 38spcl or S&W38, but 38 Colt.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

Register your vote!

2009-02-20T22:56:50Z

Does the Second Amendment give individuals the right to bear arms?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/quickquestion/2007/november/popup5895.htm

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 0 replies

US foreclosure image is 2008 World Press Photo

2009-02-20T03:46:52Z

http://tinyurl.com/dkgm23

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 6 replies

More crap legistlation

2009-02-19T19:25:45Z

As far as politics goes regarding firearms it would seem that Illinois leads the nation in douche baggery with Wisconsin a close 2nd. Which is odd because California is typically notated as the liberal douce capital of America. But anyway, here is another method in which the nit-wits are trying to take away our guns.
http://www.insurancejournal.com/news/midwest/2009/02/18/97987.htm

On another note, here is a contrary article regarding the Illinois sherrif's association supporting conceal carry
http://blogs.chicagotribune.com/news_columnists_ezorn/2009/02/illinois-sheriffs-announce-backing-for-concealedcarry-of-firearms.html

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 1 reply

Another small but important victory

2009-02-18T02:29:30Z

This just went down in the city that I live in:

West Allis man not guilty in open carry gun case
By Linda Spice of the Journal Sentinel

Posted: Feb. 17, 2009 12:26 p.m.

A West Allis municipal judge today ruled in favor of a local man arrested for disorderly conduct after a neighbor complained that he was carrying a gun while planting a tree.

Judge Paul Murphy found Brad Krause not guilty of disorderly conduct in a case that drew to a hearing numerous gun rights advocates to witness what may be the first open carry gun case heard in a Wisconsin courtroom.

For Krause, however, the significance of the case extended beyond gun rights: It was an infringement on civil liberties, he said after today's decision.

"The reason people are upset about this is it's not about guns. It's about civil liberties. And we obviously have a property issue. There was no warrant issued, no exigent circumstances, no permission to enter the property, yet the police stormed in with guns drawn and put my life at risk," Krause said. "My wife was very worried that she would be a widow in short order because I was planting a tree."

West Allis Police Chief Mike Jungbluth could not be reached for comment this afternoon.

West Allis Assistant City Attorney Jenna Merten, who prosecuted the case, was in trial today and was unavailable for comment. City Attorney Scott Post declined to comment because he had not yet learned the basis for the judge's decision, he said.

West Allis police responded to Krause's home last August after a neighbor called to ask about the legality of him openly carrying a gun in a holster on his property. Police responded, arrested Krause and ticketed him for disorderly conduct, an offense he and his attorney, Steven Cain, fought during a court trial in December. Police also seized his gun.

Cain said today, "The big overarching issue is whether open carry is legal. The law in Wisconsin really only limits concealed carry. The law in Wisconsin, as we see it, is that open carry is absolutely legal, protected, and should be."

Cain argued that the U.S. Supreme Court last summer in the case of D.C. vs. Heller concluded that open carry is "an individual right that shouldn't be abridged by law enforcement. That's what the case is generally all about."

In explaining why he was carrying a gun while planting a tree, Krause said, "There's no requirement to justify why you're able to exercise constitutional rights. I and everyone else are able to go to church, they're able to vote, they're able to speak their mind. Even though the city might not like it, we have that right."

The case is also one that has been watched closely around the country, particularly by the co-founders of the Virginia-based OpenCarry.org, John Pierce and Mike Stollenwerk.

Said Pierce: "Really, the larger issue is not even a gun rights issue. It's the issue of having a disorderly conduct statute that is a catchall statute for otherwise legal behavior."

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

mini-14 or mini-30?

2009-02-14T19:01:02Z

I'm wanting a semi auto rifle/carbine and live in Kulifornia, I've been looking at the mini's for a while.
any preferance?
Pros / cons?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 92 replies

Found a stack of these in an Atlanta Restaurant...

2009-02-14T17:48:56Z

http://gunversation.tribe.net/photos/c0e46f41-3001-4286-a352-576b240b65e9

This is an excellent example of why we should be allowed to defend ourselves with total freedom. Every American should have the wherewithal to defend themselves. This would include:

1) The right education.
2) The presence of mind to be effective and safe.
3) The confidence to defend one's self.
4) The tools, whether it be a firearm, knife, pepper-spray, or just your fist.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 5 replies

first they came for my guns - - then whey wanted my life

2009-02-14T17:25:14Z

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601039&refer=columnist_mccaughey&sid=aLzfDxfbwhzs

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 10 replies

Multi shot Defense Buckshot Shells

2009-02-09T21:03:19Z

A few weeks ago I order some of these to try them out in my Mossberg 500. http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/cb.aspx?a=377126
I started out with a small box of 10 rounds to test. One shot frp, about 10 feet away into a solid core door left that door in two pieces.
Then we took the top half of the same door and placed a pumpkin behind it. Once again we fired from about 10 feet away. The pumpkin on the other side was made into instant pudding. I really really really like these rounds!

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

american arms?

2009-02-08T05:07:47Z

does anybody know anything about a company called american arms? (not north american arms, just 'american arms')

There's this little 'walther ppk' lookalike at the pawn shop, new condition in .25 acp and I thought it would be a fun little thing to own. Manufactured by 'american arms' and is more of a ppk lookalike than bersa or any other wannabe maker. In fact the only difference I can see is a slightly improved 'beaver tail' area to protect the web of the hand.

It seems to be well made and solid. But I've never heard of it and google isn't pulling up any info on this company.

They're asking $150 for the gun and 2 magazines, but I'm guessing they could be flexible.

Does anybody know anything about these guns at all???

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 17 replies

How To Call The Police

2009-02-02T08:03:03Z

George Phillips of Meridian Mississippi was going up to bed when his wife told him that he'd left the light on in the garden shed, which she could see from the bedroom window.
George opened the back door to go turn off the light but saw that there were people in the shed stealing things. He phoned the police and told them that there were burglars in his shed.

The officer asked, "Is someone in your house?" and George said no.

The officer replied that all patrols were busy, and that he should simply lock his door and an officer would be along when available. George said, "Okay," hung up, counted to 30, and phoned the police again. "Hello I just called you a few seconds ago because there were people in my shed. Well, you don't have to worry about them now cause I've just shot them all."

Then he hung up. Within five minutes three police cars, an Armed Response unit, and an ambulance showed up at the Phillips residence. Of course, the police caught the burglars red-handed. One of the Policemen said to George: "I thought you said that you'd shot them!"

George said, "I thought you said there was nobody available!"

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

Suzanna Gratia-Hupp: What the Second Amendment is REALLY For

2009-02-01T07:32:44Z

Forgive me the cross-post, but since we're the "best" gun tribe on tribe, I thought this was worth sharing again:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4069761537893819675

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 5 replies

Suppressor

2009-01-31T22:34:36Z

Almost picked up a suppressor today. Was in the store looking things over and almost told them to go ahead and start up the paperwork. It would have cost be about $450 plus taxes in total. And I started to have second thoughts, thinking "for that much I can get a whole 'nother gun, what would I ever need a suppressor for, anyway?"

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 12 replies

Are Krinkov's more accurate?

2009-01-31T05:51:47Z

Hey there. Just wanted to post a question. Are Krinkov's more accurate than their standard sized cousins? My Yugo M92 seems to be as I was able to tap a fence post back and fourth while standing. Something I could never do with my WASR's or even my M70B. Anyway I just wanted a general consensus. Mine are all 7.62's but I'll take comparisons on 5.45's too. 2/2 Warlords, Peace Out.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 1 reply

Prolly false, but funny...

2009-01-24T23:02:03Z

To the Guy Who Mugged Me Downtown (Downtown, Savannah )

Reply to: pers-982078099@craigslist.org [?]Date:2009-01-06, 3:43AM EST

I was the white guy with the black Burrberry jacket that you demanded I hand over shortly after you pulled the knife on me and my girlfriend. You also asked for my girlfriend's purse and earrings. I hope you somehow come across this message.

I'd like to apologize. I didn't expect you to crap your pants when I drew my pistol after you took my jacket. Truth is, I was wearing the jacket for a reason that evening, and it wasn't that cold outside. You see, my girlfriend had just bought me that Kimber 1911 .45 ACP pistol for Christmas, and we had just picked up a shoulder holster for it that evening. Beautiful pistol, eh? It's a very intimidating weapon when pointed at your head, isn't it?

I know it probably wasn't a great deal of fun walking back to wherever you'd come from with that brown sludge flopping about in your pants. I'm sure it was even worse since you also ended up leaving your shoes, cell phone, and wallet with me. I couldn't have you calling up any of your buddies to come help you try to mug us again. I took the liberty of calling your mother, or "Momma" as you had her listed in your cell, and explaining to her your situation. I also bought myself some gas on your card. I gave your shoes to one of the homeless guys over by Vinnie Van Go Go's, along with all of the cash in your wallet, then I threw the wallet itself in a dumpster. I called a bunch of phone sex numbers from your cell. They'll be on your bill in case you'd like to know which ones. Alltel recently shut down the line, and I've only had the phone for a little over a day now, so I don't know what's going on with that. I hope they haven't permanently cut off your service. I was about to make some threatening phone calls to the DA's office with it.

Oh well.

So, about your pants. I know that I was a little rough on you when you did this whole attempted mugging thing, so I'd like to make it up to you. I'm sure you've already washed your pants, so I'd like to help you out. I'd like to reimburse you for the detergent you used on the pants. What brand did you use, and was it liquid or powder? I'd also like to apologize for not killing you and instead making you walk back home humiliated. I'm hoping that you'll reconsider your choice of path in life. Next time you might not be so lucky.

If you read this message, email me and we'll do lunch and laundry. Peace!

- Alex

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 4 replies

DC's new law

2009-01-14T18:47:17Z

Just this last Tuesday the municipal of council of the District of Columbia has passed new legislation [http://www.dccouncil.us/images/00001/20080716085012.pdf] Raising the bar for hand gun ownership in DC.
The new laws are supposedly going to make it harder for criminals (who ignore the law) to obtain weapons. [http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/17/us/17gun.html?_r=1] The law is also supposed to make it easier for police to track the illegal guns and criminals.

Included in the new law:
Mandatory registration every 3 years.
Mandatory 5 hours certified training
Mandatory background check every 6 years
By 2011 certain weapons will be marked to facilitate law enforcement officers in finding violent offenders.

The National Rifle Association believes that the legislation is another example [http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/12/16/AR2008121601645.html ] of the Council trying to make it harder for law-abiding citizens to own guns.

In June, the SCOTUS held against DC banning private handgun ownership in the landmark case of District of Columbia v. Heller [http://www.supremecourtus.gov/opinions/07pdf/07-290.pdf ]. The Court found that the Second Amendment bestows upon citizens an individual right to own firearms for lawful purposes.

The SCOTUS ruling ( as I predicted) will not prevent municipalities from erecting more specific barriers to gun ownership as well as limit what types of guns can be owned as well as the circumstances under which they are allowed to own them, including a resolution [http://www.dccouncil.us/images/00001/20080924114019.pdf ] passed in September to restrict the use of guns in the home to self defense purposes.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 9 replies

compressed bullet

2009-01-07T08:43:17Z

So I pulled the round out of the pipe of my Sigma (or stigma, as Adam would call it) today, and notice the thing is shorter than it usually is. Not sure how I did it, but somehow the projectile has been compressed straight down into the casing. Only time I've seen that happen (so far). Should that thing still be fire-able?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 7 replies

Rifle/shotgun Sheath $39.97

2009-01-06T04:12:11Z

A while back someone was asking about the sheath I was using for my 1895. Mine is a restored antique leather saddle sheath that I strap to my backpack in bear country.

But for those of you looking for something modern, here is something that just popped up on cheaperthandirt.com:
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/ItemDetail.aspx?sku=MOLLE-250

It's designed for a shotgun, but it'd work with a variety of rifles including lever guns. Now you got something to carry your boomstick :)

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 5 replies

The lawful criminal

2009-01-02T19:12:46Z

A right not excercised is a right forfeited. Open carry in open-carry states is perfectly legal, and it will get you arrested every time.

http://www.philly.com/philly/hp/news_update/20081212_Gun-toting_woman_divides_community.html?viewAll=y

A woman acting completely within the law, has become a public nuissance for her lawful actions. How sad.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 10 replies

Statistics

2009-01-01T16:46:02Z

Granted, this is supposed to be a joke, but are these stats anywhere close to being true?

Doctors vs. Gun Owners

Doctors

(A) The number of physicians in the U.S. Is 700,000.

(B) Accidental deaths caused by Physicians Per year are 120,000.

(C) Accidental deaths per physician is 0.171

Statistics courtesy of U.S. Dept of Health and Human Services.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Now think about this: Guns

(A) The number of gun owners in the U.S. 80,000,000.
(Yes, that's 80 million)

(B) The number of accidental gun deaths Per year, all age groups, is 1,500.

(C) The number of accidental deaths Per gun owner is 000188.

Statistics courtesy of FBI

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

So, statistically, doctors are approximately 9,000 times more dangerous than gun owners.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Remember, 'Guns don't kill people, doctors do.'

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

FACT: NOT EVERYONE HAS A GUN, BUT ALMOST EVERYONE HAS AT LEAST ONE DOCTOR.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Please alert your friends To this Alarming threat.

We must ban doctors Before this gets completely out of hand!!!!!

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Out of concern for the public at large, I withheld the statistics on Lawyers

For fear the shock would cause People to panic and seek medical attention!

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

Intelligent Political Discussion

2008-12-28T14:09:20Z

We've gotten rid of the miscreants there, and in the ensuing silence, one person has wondered if "one of the govenors in the states has told the people of the state that they should arm themselves."

Does this ring a bell with anyone? And if you have any comments, please feel free to start a new thread on the topic in there:

http://SmartPolitics.tribe.net/

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 24 replies

Shottie Shopping

2008-12-22T05:39:33Z

I'm looking at the Remington 870, the Mossberg 500, and I am tempted by the NEF 'Pardner Pump' which as far as I can tell, is H&R's knockoff of the 870... even the internal parts are interchangeable. The pardner pump is going around here for $180 NIB.... tempting.

A guy at a store said he preferred the remington over the mossberg, on account the action-release bothers his hand where it sits behind the trigger guard on the mossie, and is comfortably in front of the trigger guard on the 870.... He also says the loading gate is more prone to getting sticks and crap in it on the mossie on account it is a rather skeletal little piece, compared to Remington's generous metal flap.

Just looking at price tags, my comparisson is more between the NEF pardner pump, and the mossberg 500. For my intents and purposes I don't know if the remington is enough of a difference to pay for.

I'm really interested in hearing from folks who own any of these guns and what they like/dislike about them, and what they would reccommend?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 13 replies

I'm selling it...

2008-12-17T23:32:00Z

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=11800588

In case anyone is interested...

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 5 replies

home invasion

2008-12-12T21:03:41Z

a while back , Thousand made me think about how I could break into my house, If my family were held hostage, now some of the precautions I had already taken would serve me well if I improvised a bit, my house is set up so we can evacuate it quickly, and the o shit bag in the tunnel between my basement and garage would help. If I had to run , on my way out I had always planned on setting off tear gas behind me, thousand made me realize that I could use this to get in my house, so I modified my plans to work either way, I made one pretty big change, I think trying to use a assault rifle in the house would be a big pain in the butt, so I went looking for one of those semi auto uzi copies, and I found somthin wayy more gooder, a pair of 30 rd clips for my beretta, I have the firepower I wanted, easy to move around and handle, for 30 bucks. I already had the pistol. extended pistol mags may be worth lookin into for some of yall. I hope this helps

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 16 replies

What's this?

2008-12-10T22:09:43Z

FDA approval for a gun?

http://rawstory.com/news/2008/Company_hopes_to_gun_for_seniors_1208.html

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

2 Reloading Questions

2008-12-04T17:23:29Z

Played around with jacketed bullets for awhile, and now am getting into lead-cast bullets. I have a few questions about the differences and their importance.

For one, I notice you can't really 'over-crimp' a jacketed bullet. But all-lead bullets can be crimped lightly, or very heavily. Does this make a big difference in pressures? Is it easy to 'overcrimp' to a point that could be dangerous? how would you know when that point was achieved?

Also, jacketed bullets generally have a distinctive 'crimp groove' that's a pretty obvious indicator to set your bullet-depth. Some of the bullets I have are generally straight-sided, with a lube groove down low. There is no distinct 'crimp groove'... and I'm wondering, how critical is seating-depth? I'm mostly concerned about the ammount of space left inside the case, and how this affects internal pressures and safety margins. Case Overall Length is more a matter of feed reliability, not safety.

I'm pretty much just loading .357 magnum at this point, still. Any experienced advice would be super valuable to me.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 8 replies

Dad wants a new gun

2008-12-04T14:59:51Z

He's looking for a stainless revolver for camping and backpacking. I don't know if he would ever actually carry it concealed, but he likes the idea of having that option. Mostly he wants a backwoods gun, and .357 magnum seems to be his caliber of choice. He is very on-the-fence about DA vs. SA... probably could go either way.

He's also a real budget-nazi. So cheaper brands known for reliability would be placed above fancy brands known for smoothness or good looks. And he cares absolutely nothing for brand-names or what people would think. Whatever works is whatever works. If it's a brand name, so be it. If it's not, that's fine as long as it's reliable and good.

What would you suggest?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 5 replies

make your own guns

2008-12-03T22:14:21Z

It's legal. No paperwork. Here's where you get the parts to do it:

https://www.vbd.com/noc/shop/default.asp

most parts just need a couple holes drilled in them to be 'complete' but because they are not complete, they are sold as 'replacement parts' and no paperwork is needed at all.

Check with your local state laws. the BATF says it's okay as long as they're not automatic, or below legal specifications (no sawed off shotguns, etc) and within any other existing restrictions in your area, regarding caliber, capacity, pistol grips & bayonettes, etc.

Yes. This means that if you are legal to own a firearm at all, you can have an AK47 or an AR15 of your very own, or any other legal gun, with zero paperwork and zero reccord. (make sure you buy your parts with cash or money-order, not on your card or checks) You just can't sell it or transfer it to anyone else.

Seriously. Very seriously think about this.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 1 reply

410 shotgun

2008-12-02T01:29:41Z

A brother of mine recently got ahold of a little .410 single shot.... I've never considered them as serving any useful purpose. This one is stainless steel with a synthetic stock, and holds four shots stored in the butt of the stock. The whole thing is built to minimum dimensions, so it fits in a backpack easily and is rugged as heck. It's easier to hold like a pistol, than to try to shoulder the diminutive stock an crane your neck enough to look along the barrel. But it's simple and rugged and small. All in all it looks like a really great little 'woodland survival' tool, much like the AR7 .22

But I know nothing about the round. What can you do with a .410? What kind of game can you expect to take and at what ranges? Is there an option for slugs and what would this do for the gun's versatility?

Would you consider a single-shot .410 as a good choice for similar scenarios as the AR7 was designed for?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

White Lithium Grease

2008-11-15T04:24:20Z

I got curious. Most of my 'moving parts' knowledge base is automotive. This idea occurs to me, ''White lithium grease is used to smoothly lubricate metal parts in ALL kinds of temperatures... it goes on like water, flows into cracks, and then sets up as a hard(ish) white grease that is designed not to attract dirt. Plus, on low-to-zero-maintenance areas like car door hinges, nothing lasts longer or stays better. Why not on guns?''

So I tried some on the larger moving parts of my '92 lever. WOW what a difference. Smooth as butter! I tried it on the smaller moving parts. Not as much of a difference, but I can't tell any negative effects, either. Seems to work like a charm, and I probably won't have to re-lube it for a very, very long time.

So I took off all the oil out of my GP100 with brake cleaner (once again, thinking like a mechanic rather than a gunsmith, but hey, it works!) and lubricated ALL moving parts with white lithium grease. And I'll be damned if that trigger pull doesn't feel as good as a well-worn S&W revolver....

I'm sure that I am not the first person to come up with this idea. My question is, have you guys ever tried it? And are there any negative effects that I may be overlooking? Because I'm seriously thinking of using this in place of most of my gun lubricants.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 12 replies

lubrication

2008-11-07T04:40:33Z

I use Hoppes oils on my stuff, but have recently wondered on the possibility of using something like lithium grease on the slide rails of some of my handguns, thinking it would last longer and lubricate better than Hoppes. What do you think?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

Gas masks for 10 buks

2008-11-06T14:48:41Z

cheaper than dirt has em,im gettin a few heres the link
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/CategoryListing.aspx?catid=125

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

Gunbelt

2008-11-06T02:13:54Z

I'm in the market for a new gunbelt. Trouble is, I'm not sure what to look for.

I see features like double-sided leather, double-sided leather with a Kydex insert sandwiched between, pre-contoured (drops down in back like how most belts stretch over time, rather than straight like a new belt) and all kinds of different thicknesses and hides.

give me some reccommendations. Maybe a little 'gunbelts 101'... Who makes the best? what makes them better than others?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

Impressive...

2008-11-04T23:29:50Z

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=irykjLjuKo8

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 10 replies

Crotch Rocket!!!

2008-11-03T18:52:28Z

http://www.darkroastedblend.com/2006/12/mystery-photo-one-seriously-empowered.html

I'm usually really anti-scooter. Especially anything Piaggio/Vespa. But I want one of these.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 3 replies

check this out its cool

2008-10-24T00:26:21Z

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080921/ap_on_fe_st/odd_old_rifle_recovery;_ylt=AiiFDFvEMARR1KVTnoN3C67tiBIF
a guy buys his Dads old service rifle and gives it to him for his b day

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 4 replies

...And then there's reality...

2008-10-23T07:49:54Z

I don't even know if anyone will be able to respond to this thread, but:

Have you, or someone close to you (reputable, honest, non-embellished source) ever been involved in a real gunfight or firearms conflict?

How did the scenario play out, what got you(them) stuck in the situation, what was the experience like, how was the aftermath resolved?

As much info as you feel comfortable with, and not more, of course. Change names and places. But it occurred to me, the only model of psychological/emotional/physical preparation most people have to go off of, is what they see in Hollywood. It might be helpful for people learn about the real-life side of self defense with firearms.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 6 replies

an hypothetical question about bears attacking you.

2008-10-23T03:25:04Z

Here is a question I have always had fun pondering about when I go camping with friends.
If one were to be attacked by an huge grizzly bear, what would be the most effective weapon/round chambering be for stopping an attack if you are by yourself with a firearm.
Would .45, solid slug 12 guage , or 30-30 winchester work? if not what would?
I would like to know what your oppinion is.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 11 replies

Homemade gunleather

2008-10-23T03:18:31Z

Well, I posted this thread once before but it appears to have been lost.

Long story short, I wanted a VersaMax 2 -style holster for my GP100.... but they're expensive, and most of all I don't want to wait till next spring to get it. Also, I'm pretty sure they don't make em for revolvers.

So I went down to the local tanner. I bought a half-belly of horsehide for around $20, and I asked him 'What the heck and I supposed to do with this?' since I've never really done any leather work. He was happy to give me a basic foothold of understanding about wet-forming, basically you just soak the leather, lay it over the gun, and use a hard tool to press it into all the cracks and crannies and shapes. It sounded pretty easy.

It took me about six hours of forming and stitching, but it's done now. It was so amazingly easy! I used the back end of the handle of a butterknife to form the leather, used a nail and hammer to punch the sewing holes, and some nylon 'canvas repair' waxed thread for the stitches. Some of the stitches are all buggered up, but for the most part it's not a bad looking holster.

I'll upload a picture into the photo gallery. I would reccommend this project to anybody. As I said, this is my first leather project. Go see how easy it is.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

Shatner on gun control

2008-10-18T19:32:53Z

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zafAtFzRmME

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 9 replies

Marlin Papoose

2008-09-22T13:49:22Z

Any thougts on this as compaired to the AR-7 from Henry's

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

Assault rifles

2008-09-21T23:13:31Z

as I was looking over what I have, I noticed I dont have anything that will throw a lot of rounds out inna hurry , except my sks. Im looking at 3 different guns as well as adding a cpl more sks to the collection.
the fal in .308 essentially a .308 ar15
mini .30
mini 14
Im not a real big fan of the .223, but the mini 14 is a awesome little gun, asn as much as I like the Ak 47, I think the sks performs just as well for 1/2 the price any Ideas yall?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 12 replies

it doesn't draw easily

2008-09-12T03:11:08Z

So I've found one disadvantage to my small-o'-the-back ITP carry of my small Bersa Thunder 9. This particular cloth holster (I just got it) makes it nearly impossible to draw without some coaxing. Perhaps a leather one would be better.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 10 replies

Images

2008-09-11T13:33:46Z

So I was mulling over a recent gun-control argument with a friend and had an idea for a quick message which summarized one point I was making. I found a couple of images and added my idea to them. They're posted in our photo album. What do you think? Too much? Wrong argument? Better way to do it?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 1 reply

Saiga rifles

2008-09-09T23:43:06Z

The price is right and the ak design is cool. Are they Crap? Or a pretty good gun?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies

Carry in a National Forest

2008-08-28T01:03:14Z

National parks as we all know, are among the list of places where law abiding citizens are rendered defenseless by those who claim to have our best interests at heart....

What about national forests? I know you can hunt in them during season, but what are the laws about open carry, or recreational/target shooting? Is there a uniform, federal set of laws (I would guess) or do they go by the state's local laws?

What's the deal on guns in National Forrests?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 16 replies

Best .357 load for wilderness defense

2008-08-28T00:59:11Z

Goin on a backpacking trip to the high uintas in a couple weeks here. Gone for seven days, up in the high wilderness, plenty of mountain lions, moose (they get grumpy sometimes), and black bear. (I hear there may be a bigfoot sasquatch or two, hehe)

All I have is a GP100 .357 in the way of camping handguns. I'm going to buy some more reloading supplies tomorrow anyhow, and I figured I might as well ask:

What would be the recommendation for self defense bullets to load for such an occasion? What type, weight, shape and velocity should I aim for?

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 7 replies

Goin to the range

2008-08-19T07:10:34Z

So I'm taking my newly aquired single shot .20 ga out today, I've got 100 rounds and 100 clay pidgeons and I'll be damned if I'm not going to figure out this 'shotgun' thing. I'm not used to not having sights, and I'm not used to having a slow enough projectile that you have to lead the target. But I figure, I'm a pretty good pistol shot, I'm a decent long gun shot, I might as well round it out with these backwards and counter-intuitive things called shotguns. Wish me luck.

posted in Gunversation; a tribe to discuss guns - 2 replies